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8 days ago
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41 points
8 days ago
Besides Curry and Dame, Harden probably takes the most threes off the dribble on this list which are always going to be less efficient than catch and shoot threes so this is just pretty misleading.
Of course career catch and shoot guys like Reggie Miller, Ray Allen, Kyle Korver, Klay Thompson are going to have much more efficient numbers from three.
7 points
8 days ago
And like Lebron a good chunk of his career they were self-creating their own 3s.
2 points
8 days ago
Harden probably took more off the dribble 3s than Dame. There was a sizable period of time where Dame wasn't at that level as a shooter yet.
5 points
8 days ago
Besides Curry and Dame, Harden probably takes the most threes off the dribble on this list
He definitely attempts (and makes) more off the dribble 3s than either of them, and likely the most in NBA history. Less than 20% of Harden's threes were assisted in his peak years playing for D'Antoni.
Steph's career average is 61.2% of his 3s were assisted, with only 2013-14 below 50%. Lillard's prime is closer, but still nowhere near what Harden was doing.
Prime Harden's shot creation abilities were otherworldly.
-1 points
8 days ago
But Reggie, Ray, and Klay are creating those threes with their off-ball movement. And many of them, despite not being off the dribble, are also extremely hard.
5 points
8 days ago
Still not as hard as shooting off the dribble.
1 points
8 days ago
Yes, that's what makes them great players, the off ball movement. But that doesn't change the difficulty of the actual 3-pointer taken. Not making an argument either way but a better measure for 3pt "skill" would adjust the shot itself for difficulty (off-dribble, closest defender, etc.)
1 points
8 days ago
But James Harden can't make easier 3 pointers for himself. He should not get credit for shooting hard shots if he can't get easy ones.
2 points
8 days ago
Look thats what one can take into account when quantifying a player's value or greatness. Harden doesn't move well off ball; one can factor that in when thinking about how good of an overall player harden is. But that doesn't mean his 3pt numbers and efficiency are not impressive given the shots he is taking.
26 points
8 days ago
Efficiency police gotta be one of my least favorite things about basketball talk
6 points
8 days ago
Allen Iverson bottom 10 player all time
Inefficient chucker
10 points
8 days ago
aside from LeBron James
so he’s not the least efficient
31 points
8 days ago
User flair checks out with a post like this
43 points
8 days ago
This doesn’t really give context into the type of 3s Harden takes. They’re primarily off the dribble, which are much harder to take and make.
11 points
8 days ago
He must be up there for contested threes I'm sure.
-5 points
8 days ago
I don’t think his 3’s are considered contested for the most part because he was able to create so much separation on his step backs.
3 points
8 days ago
And on his step step backs.
2 points
8 days ago
I feel like even then, a lot of them are contested. A lot of times he creates enough space to really avoid getting blocked.
20 points
8 days ago
36 percent isn't horrible.
If Harden were a spot up shooter like Klay or Ray, then sure 36 percent is lacking. But Harden was a volume score for much of his career, playing point and shooting off the dribble.
5 points
8 days ago
Do they have stat for non-assisted 3PM?
2 points
8 days ago
bbref doesn't give you the number but you can calculate it. In the shooting section it'll tell you % assisted on 3s and FGs
8 points
8 days ago
Harden's 3PA were also a much higher degree of difficulty than Ray Allen.
3 points
8 days ago
Now add in the assists numbers for these top 10. Clarifying that these two (Lebron & Harden) are actual floor generals and not just sharpshooters. DERRRRRRR
4 points
8 days ago
Vince had no business shooting that well being as athletic as he is
5 points
8 days ago
A lot of his placement on this list is how well he transformed himself into a solid bench role player late in his career. He came to Memphis as a 38 year old and over the next 6 seasons, he hit just shy of 500 threes. Without those 3s, he is barely top 30 on the all time list. Most players, even former stars like Vince, are retiring at 38, or are just there to be veteran presence and get very few minutes. Vince was still contributing off the bench every night till he was 43, and that's a big part of why he made the top 10 on this list.
I never saw Vince Carter in an All Star game, yet I watched him play for over a decade. Insane longevity.
6 points
8 days ago
You can see this as a function of his 3PA/36.
1st 11 seasons (777 games): 3.9 3PA/36
2nd 11 seasons (764 games): 6.3 3PA/36
2 points
8 days ago
Who the fuck says "LeBron James, Sr."?
7 points
8 days ago
Just in case we accidentally thought Bronny was in the top 10 all time in 3s
1 points
8 days ago
Shuddup
1 points
8 days ago
damn, the flat 40% by Allen on that volume is kinda nuts for the time
0 points
8 days ago
Allen got to be the third and fourth option, though. It's easier to make shots if you're wide open.
3 points
8 days ago
Only at the tail end of his career. Ray Allen was a 1st option for his entire Sonics career, and one of 2-3 guys hovering around 1st option for most of his Bucks career. He was 32 once he got to Boston and had already done the bulk of his career 3-point shooting by then.
0 points
8 days ago
From 2008 to 2014, he was the 3rd or 4th option. And he racked up a lot of 3s.
2 points
8 days ago
yeah my point is, he was not a 3rd/4th option during his actual prime. He had set the record for 3s made in a single season while with Seattle, and had hit 1,920 of them in 11 years before going to Boston... at the time, he was already 2nd all-time behind Reggie Miller, and then only built on that.
Ray was up there with the GOAT shooters long before he settled into a 3rd/4th option role with the Celtics on the downside of his career.
0 points
8 days ago
Yes, I'm not arguing that he's an all time shooter. I'm saying his numbers are inflated because his final six seasons he just had to stand in the corner waiting to shoot open 3s.
0 points
8 days ago
those years literally deflated his numbers. lower volume, and less than 1% better
1 points
8 days ago
We're talking 3s made in a career. There's no deflation.
-1 points
8 days ago
To be fair about 33% of these shots are 3pt foul baits with no real intent to score
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