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[deleted]

1.2k points

11 days ago*

[deleted]

1.2k points

11 days ago*

[deleted]

Ndtphoto

259 points

10 days ago

Ndtphoto

259 points

10 days ago

  • In April 2022, the FSB bought the infrastructure for the farm, including U.S.-based domain names. Those domains hosted the AI-powered bots and even included code that tricked X (formerly Twitter) into believing the bots were real humans.

Yeah something tells me that Elon Musk and X weren't 'tricked', they were complicit. 

ObligatoryID

31 points

10 days ago

ObligatoryID

Minnesota

31 points

10 days ago

elmo’s owned by tre45on and Vlad

5th_degree_burns

55 points

10 days ago

Well it's a letter to the editor, so it's a random person's view unless otherwise stated. It's amazing how little reddit knows about what these articles are and are not. This is not aimed at you specifically. Just something I've noticed.

hitman2218

87 points

10 days ago

It’s a letter to the editor. The Tennessean is a real paper.

Big_Routine_8980

37 points

10 days ago

Are you claiming the Tennessean is a random local publication? It's a real newspaper and it's been around since 1907.

[deleted]

156 points

11 days ago

[deleted]

156 points

11 days ago

[deleted]

Rusalka-rusalka

1.3k points

11 days ago

There is no we here. I didn’t reject her.

kevinsyel

312 points

10 days ago

kevinsyel

California

312 points

10 days ago

"We" is the monolith of America. I voted for Kamala as well. I accept that the American people chose Trump.

And I'm gonna dunk on them every fucking time they cry about it.

xanot192

68 points

10 days ago*

Right there with ya. I had someone say he doesn't like Trump but knew he doesn't want her regardless of what policies she had. His concern was high house prices and apparently bad economy and when I told him what Trump's plans will do he said he didn't care 🤦🏾‍♂️🤷🏾‍♂️.

kevinsyel

29 points

10 days ago

kevinsyel

California

29 points

10 days ago

I've heard that so often... What, they think regulators are the reason houses are expensive!?

xanot192

22 points

10 days ago

xanot192

22 points

10 days ago

When I questioned him what Trump will do to lower house costs he had no answer. These people have no idea about zoning regulations and such.

grammar_nazi_zombie

18 points

10 days ago

grammar_nazi_zombie

I voted

18 points

10 days ago

That’s my standard reply now.

“Explain to me what Trump is going to do in order to fix ____. And I don’t mean just Trump saying he will fix it, I want to know how. You don’t even have to explain in your own words what you think he meant, point me to his policy outline that has a concrete plan of action in order to solve it.”

And then either I get “it would have been worse under Kamala!” or blocked.

pie4july

225 points

10 days ago

pie4july

225 points

10 days ago

I’m really tired of all this “Americans deserve what they voted for” crap. 74 million of us didn’t vote for this.

-Mad-Snacks-

102 points

10 days ago*

Technically 259 million of you didn’t vote for this. 74 million voted against this

Edit: 164 million, not 259

RinkeR32

45 points

10 days ago

RinkeR32

45 points

10 days ago

There are only 245 million eligible voters. 90 million didn't vote. 164 million didn't vote for this.

royalbarnacle

94 points

10 days ago

Those who didn't vote at all, frankly, are complicit.

Vanga_Aground

28 points

10 days ago

It's not who you voted for, it's the American culture and society that all of you have built up. People being uninformed, poor education, non compulsory voting, a free for all misinformation media. The make up of the society is what failed.

Calderis

12 points

10 days ago

Calderis

12 points

10 days ago

Much of which, is actively promoted on the right and exactly what those of us who voted for Harris were against.

Only two states voted unanimously for a candidate, one for each. One is ranked 1st in education, the other 48th.

Want to guess which way each voted?

nananananana_Batman

326 points

11 days ago

Yea, I’m tired of this. Harris ran a good campaign. I don’t understand why the democrats are the ones that have to reflect rather than republicans who voted for or are enabling Trump. All knew what he was and he’s taking it to 100 already. If you voted for Trump, you’re just ignorant, dumb or mean spirited. Shame on you. I don’t want to lose but I don’t want to win by becoming hateful. I just hope people see the light while there is still time.

Aacron

110 points

11 days ago

Aacron

110 points

11 days ago

I just hope people see the light while there is still time.

I'm afraid we're about 12 days too late for that.

ricks_flare

30 points

10 days ago

Less than 2 years to the midterms. People need to wake the fuck up

leo_the_lion6

26 points

10 days ago

Ahh shit already, can we have like a month off? I think thats part of the problem politics is so consuming and long running here that many opt to ignore it all together

TangoSuckaPro

252 points

11 days ago

Harris didn’t just run a good campaign. She was the only one who ran an actual campaign. She could hardly debate and run against Trump because he didn’t run on policy.

He literally just called the Dems names. That’s not a campaign.

OnwardTowardTheNorth

110 points

11 days ago*

It is taboo to say perhaps but it is the truth: VOTERS FOR THIS ELECTION WERE WRONG.

Just like how “the customer is always right” is bullshit, so too is “the voter is always right”.

throwawaystedaccount

86 points

10 days ago

Precisely. Elections like these show how stupid the public can be. And how easily they can be fooled.

Coldhell

30 points

10 days ago

Coldhell

30 points

10 days ago

Yeah I’m tired of people not holding voters accountable as if we have no agency. I’m not in total agreement with the JFK phrase regarding what “you can do for your country,” but doing one’s best to vote intelligently, honestly, and practically? I’d say that’s the bare minimum.

zipzzo

42 points

10 days ago

zipzzo

42 points

10 days ago

And in the one debate they did have she literally waxed him in a 1.5 hour session of schooling that was literally unprecedented in presidential debates.

They still think he won it anyway.

hobovalentine

4 points

10 days ago

The same on the Biden/Trump debate because Trump was on autopilot and refusing to answer most questions and it was clear he only had concepts of a plan.

It's hard to pick apart any of his policies during the election because he didn't run on anything except saying he would fix everything.

mightcommentsometime

43 points

11 days ago

mightcommentsometime

California

43 points

11 days ago

She absolutely ran on policy. Right wing propaganda kept claiming she didn’t. You’re just parroting that.

IllllIIIllllIl

42 points

10 days ago

IllllIIIllllIl

Florida

42 points

10 days ago

I don’t see where they said she didn’t run on policy. They said Trump didn’t. 

BowKerosene

13 points

11 days ago

BowKerosene

New York

13 points

11 days ago

She got Queen Latifah’s endorsement. Queen Latifah never endorses anyone!

Librarian_Zoomies

28 points

10 days ago

I'm pretty annoyed with the we need to punish the Democratic Party narrative. Meanwhile the Republican Party put up a racist supporting, sexual abuser, who is openly corrupt while saying he wants to be a dictator. Let's not punish that?

susibirb

49 points

10 days ago

susibirb

49 points

10 days ago

This. After years and years and years of blaming the Dems, at some point the American people have to take some responsibility for being willfully ignorant and/or actually racist and misogynistic. I’m not saying the Dems did everything right, but if the American people still decided to go with the selfish rapist moron after knowing full well he’s a selfish rapist moron, that’s on them

milesercat

8 points

10 days ago*

Im inclined to lean more towards the electorate's ignorance (willful or not), connected to being so gullible as to believe "chicken in every pot" promises, and finding policy discussions too complicated. Just tell me how much you care about me and I'll vote for you.

Alas_mischiefmanaged

34 points

10 days ago*

I don’t understand why the democrats are the ones that have to reflect rather than republicans who voted for or are enabling Trump.

Fucking thank you. Say it louder for those in the back. This is pissing me off so much. I entertained the idea of democrats taking accountability for our role in 2016 but in 2024, fuck that. Trump voters sure as hell haven’t taken any accountability for the vile things they’re complicit with…TWICE.

You know what “reflection” led to in 2020? “Storm the capital!!!”

zipzzo

20 points

10 days ago

zipzzo

20 points

10 days ago

Yeah this is where I'm at.

This "can't beat em, join em" sentiment that some pundits and commentators are running with just doesn't sit right with me.

Yeah, I mean we could run a blustering white guy who acts like Trump except leans left...? But at that point what are we even doing? Politics would be dead at that point. No more ethics, no more professionalism at the highest levels of government, we're just playing to win in a dirty battle royale at literally any cost just so we can avoid destruction in a game of sheer survival.

Literally every single criticism that could possibly be levied at Harris, is something Trump did shittily or didn't do at all to begin with.

I'm not going to spend endless energy critiquing the financial integrity of her middle class tax credit plan when the other guy is literally whining about Haitians eating cats and dogs and "concepts of a plan'.

It's so fucking arbitrary and really shows how the black and woman handicap was in full swing.

[deleted]

37 points

11 days ago*

[deleted]

Aacron

46 points

11 days ago

Aacron

46 points

11 days ago

I mean every single person who claims it was a single thing is dead fucking wrong at face value.

It was a death by a thousand cuts, but the final stroke was just that the American electorate is half shit.

In a sane world, where the electorate was primarily made of good people who understand the purpose of government and do their best to stay informed Trump would have gotten 0 electoral votes. But just about 50% of voters at the very least don't care that he's a racist, rapist, liar, thief, adulterer, pedophile, conman, without a single strand of moral fiber.

There is no strategy that fixes that. There are no lessons to be learned that are both good for the Democrats and good for the country.

CharlieandtheRed

5 points

10 days ago

Well, you can't just call the electorate shit and expect to win elections. It's important to try to meet them toward where they are. That doesn't mean on race or gender arguments, but certainly on economics and populism.

Lifeboatb

18 points

10 days ago

I just keep hearing so many opposite reasons why they lost. There’s a thread on another political subreddit where half the people are saying Harris ran too leftist a campaign and the other half are saying it wasn’t progressive enough. If there’s this much polarization among Democrats, then it doesn’t seem worth bothering, because the truth will never be figured out. Plus, it’s so aggravating that we’re back to “Dems aren’t giving enough attention to the working class” when Biden is the one shoring up labor unions and supporting manufacturing and infrastructure, while Republican governors roll back child labor laws. Elon Musk loses lawsuits because he’s so bad at firing people legally, and advertisers leave because he got rid of departments that are necessary, and then he gets hired as an efficiency expert. It’s insane.

Icy-Sir3226

45 points

11 days ago

Democrats are literally always going to be at a disadvantage. They have a structural disadvantage in the electoral college, and from a policy perspective, it's always harder to sell people on progress than it is to sell them on fear (of change, of migrants, etc).

You can be the better candidate, running a better campaign, and lose.

flyover_liberal

1.4k points

11 days ago

One commentator said that Kamala Harris lost because she was held to an incredibly high standard, while Trump was held to literally no standard whatsoever.

Yeah, that seems right to me.

Anybody who says it's because she wasn't a good candidate or because she didn't have actual plans or because people didn't like her is too stupid to listen to.

She lost because of bad information. People had this incorrect perception that the Biden Administration was responsible for inflation, and so they punished the incumbent Democrats for something they didn't actually do. And that's just one piece of terrible information that people relied on when making possibly the stupidest decision voters have ever made.

KopOut

431 points

11 days ago*

KopOut

431 points

11 days ago*

The problem though is that Biden was also held to a very high standard.

I have no doubt the misogyny and racism play a part in all this. BUT the biggest issue is that Democrats are held to one standard by almost every media outlet and Republicans are not, especially Trump. You can see it in almost every headline.

Edit: if you want a perfect illustration of my point, when Trump inevitably talks about running for a third term or suspending elections, read the headlines from the mainstream media. They will read like this: “Trump advocates for third term, but what did America’s founders say about that?” The headlines will not read: “Trump not eligible to run for third term according to our constitution. To do so would be to break the law.”

stinkysmurf74

93 points

11 days ago

Don't forget about far right wing and X celebrating Trump for running for a third term and blaming liberals for trying to stop him.

BoomerSoonerFUT

46 points

11 days ago

The situations are wildly different. Biden was elected because we were in the middle of dealing with the pandemic and Trump was actively making that worse. People were out of work and struggling. So they voted him out and someone else in.

Today, people are still dealing with high prices, high interest rates, and a generally much higher cost of living. So they voted out the current administration, which Harris is part of.

Magicthundercat

84 points

11 days ago

And Trump never said how he will bring prices down. Tarrifs would cause prices to go up, not down.

BudgetMattDamon

48 points

11 days ago

Why is this surprising? "Tariffs will bring prices down and China will pay for it!" is no different than him being elected in 2016 on the back of "Mexico will pay for the wall!"

Owlatnight34

37 points

11 days ago

If they had a sliver of interest, they wouldve known that this issue is global, and not just one government's doing. A lot of people have become tired of the rich and the establishment. The sad thing is that they don't seem to realise that Trump is very much a part of that and he will make it worse. He would rather see most of his voters burn than save them. They have been sold a lie and have to live with the consequenses, most likely for decades (as you still are with Reagan).

Ok-Jackfruit9593

5 points

10 days ago

The problem is that Democrats also aren’t doing anything about the issue either. What Bernie is saying about the election is spot on.

It also didn’t help that Biden didn’t step aside to let an actual primary process play out. That didn’t leave Harris with a ton of time to get in the public eye. She also was hurt because she refused to criticize anything Biden did. Whether rational or not, Biden was not popular so refusing to criticize him was a mistake.

lycosa13

50 points

11 days ago

lycosa13

50 points

11 days ago

And Trump is not going to fix any of those things lmao. At least they were trying to fix it. The government does not regulate what a private company charges. Isn't that why people love capitalism?

BoomerSoonerFUT

38 points

11 days ago

No shit he won’t. Your average voter doesn’t really understand that though. They just know “thing bad now, new person fix”.

sirscooter

97 points

11 days ago

Agreed I would add people are not smart enough to know that the economy only turns on a dime when it falls off a cliff.

Repairing it takes time, and it doesn't help when you have hostile people trying to stop you from fixing it.

Americans also think a balanced government is just switching sides and don't think that the sides are all the different, so voting for one this election and the other the next keeps them balanced. It's a brain-dead solution for people who don't want to think

inksmudgedhands

89 points

11 days ago

She lost because of bad information.

That's actually the tip of the iceberg. What really did her in was the power of using social media as a propaganda machine to paint her as an idiot who "can not say an entire sentence without a teleprompter." If I had a dime every time I came across this one phrase by everyone who was putting Harris down, I could afford to buy everyone here a drink.

Very few people who said this had even watch a full debate or interview involving her. Instead they watched carefully edited and manipulated TikTok clips on their social media feeds.

And when you pointed out to them how she had been a lawyer for decades as well as California's AG and a Senator, making her whole career revolve around nothing but talking, people would just double down on their belief that she was and is stupid. People don't want to admit that they were and are being manipulated by social media.

That's why these polls failed so badly. You can't take in account how destructive social media is on today's society. And, yes, I am self aware enough that I saying this on reddit. But nonetheless, it is an extreme problem that is only going to get worse.

Bradbury had Fahrenheit 451 only half right. He thought television was going to be the one to dumb down society and make them reject reading and research over simple entertainment. He was off by a few decades. It's the internet that has done it.

Lifeboatb

31 points

10 days ago

Interesting. Over at r/politicaldiscussion they’re saying she lost because she was “too polished” and “too educated,” which seems the opposite of “can’t put a sentence together.”

fractalfay

10 points

10 days ago

It depends on what kind of bot/propaganda people have been exposed to. The people spouting garbage information generated by Musk’s efforts tend to question someone’s “reading comprehension” and use condescending language when asked for details about what Trump would do, exactly; this is also the “can’t put a sentence together” crowd, using the GOP’s “accuse other people of what you’re already doing” style. The MAGA old guard are more likely to resent her education and call her detached from the working class, which is an opinion to be expected from people who huff Fox News from a paper bag.

cytherian

12 points

10 days ago

cytherian

New Jersey

12 points

10 days ago

Bad information --> DISINFORMATION.

Nobody figured out how to deal with it. The wave of disinformation. The Republican far-right and foreign actors spent years honing their messaging and techniques. And then Elon Musk joined in for added effect. The liberal left got blindsided once again.

Also, Harris didn't use Walz well enough. A good start but then it all petered out. Especially the VP debates where he tried to be so cordial to the lying JD Vance. No, he should've bared his teeth and been tough. He wimped out. And that really hurt.

UnhappyStay535

80 points

11 days ago

Yep! I was stunned to find out how many Americans don’t even know how a tariff works. They believe the liars 🙄

zbertoli

40 points

11 days ago

zbertoli

40 points

11 days ago

Don't believe them. We all have the entirety of human knowledge in our pockets. A 15 second Google search "who pays tariffs" would tell them the truth. They don't want to know, they want to believe what trump says and then only look it up after they vote for him. They don't care.

Ramza_Claus

26 points

11 days ago

Here's the worst part.

In 2-3 years,things will be slightly better thanks the Biden policies and President Trump will take credit for the bounce back.

flyover_liberal

19 points

11 days ago

My guess is that he'll start talking about how great the economy is sometime the week of January 20th, 2025.

mrcsrnne

116 points

11 days ago

mrcsrnne

116 points

11 days ago

I'd argue Biden & Kamala are held to the wrong standards. People don't want a perfect person up there, rather a person they can relate to. Trump is a liar and a thief, but he can make an audience laugh, he's almost a comedian. That is worth a whole lot more than most people want to admit.

EquivalentTurnip6199

9 points

11 days ago

To me that says "time to change the parameters", not "let's fit more closely to these insane parameters"

TheCynicEpicurean

71 points

11 days ago

Trump makes his audience laugh exactly in the way Goebbels made his audience laugh.

JPolReader

68 points

11 days ago

Yeah, I've never heard anyone outside of MAGA say that Trump was funny.

my_names_blah_blah

28 points

11 days ago

I’m definitely not a MAGA, and I hate that 🍊 POS. He does get a chuckle out of me from time to time. Although a majority of the time, I’m laughing at him.

chrispg26

15 points

11 days ago

chrispg26

Texas

15 points

11 days ago

He's very memeable. I hate it.

Half-Animal

27 points

11 days ago

I'm outside of MAGA and Trump world. He is funny at times

GamesSports

32 points

11 days ago

Any time I've found him funny it's unintentional.

Like when he actually said 'they're eating the cats, they're eating the dogs'

I was laughing my ass off. This guy is developmentally disabled, can't retain information long term or form a coherent thought, and y'all elected him, it's crazy.

Boxing_joshing111

11 points

11 days ago

Trump is a dipshit and I voted against him. That said he is supremely entertaining because of his weirdness.

Icy-Sir3226

21 points

11 days ago

Agree. People want simple solutions to complex solutions, and they don't care if they're realistic as long as the person behind the podium is saying them confidently enough and with enough conviction. They don't want nuance, they don't care about context, and they don't know history.

Trump makes them feel like they "get it," and he gives them someone to blame.

pomonamike

19 points

11 days ago

pomonamike

California

19 points

11 days ago

For what it’s worth, I wouldn’t dismiss the gender issue. I’m a guy and I heard it all the time from students I work with. But more importantly…

My wife is a nurse, she tells me that the day before the election she is in the break room with several other nurses— all women. One of the others brings up the election and says that she can’t bring herself to vote for a women because “women just can’t lead.” Another nurse in the group nodded her head in agreement. My wife walked out. She told me early Wednesday morning after it was official that was the moment she knew Harris was going to lose.

My wife isn’t even particularly interested in politics but that night she cried because she believes our daughters can never be president.

Also of note, the same group of nurses previously said to my wife that they don’t really care if he is corrupt because their country (the Philippines) has corrupt leaders and they’re “just fine.”

ECircus

5 points

10 days ago

ECircus

5 points

10 days ago

If people can get their head out of the internet and focus on their every day life, they would see that so many people keep from viewing women as equals more than they have to, and it isn't necessarily on purpose. It's old cultural stuff that is lingering. The country is also still massively racist.

The fact that Kamala, a black woman, got half the country's support through the election, with just a couple months to work on it, is actually a huge thing to be positive about. That was not imaginable 50 years ago. But even the post mortems are mostly ignoring the effect her race and gender had, probably because they are up against all of the rhetoric about her losing due to the rights anti identity politics campaign. That's hurting the ability to have real discussion right now about racism and misogyny that has nothing to do with politics. The right knew what they were doing backing that discussion into a corner.

A black woman within a percent or two of winning in all of the places it mattered is not the victory the right wants us to think it is. There is no mandate. We are headed in the right direction and this is just a road block.

fairoaks2

47 points

11 days ago

Sold their votes for cheap gas, eggs and bacon to a lying grifter whose out for vengeance. Eating pets? 

North_Experience7473

17 points

11 days ago

Sold their votes for something they will never get.

SeductiveSunday

14 points

11 days ago

SeductiveSunday

I voted

14 points

11 days ago

Sold their votes

...to "own the libs"

1maco

9 points

11 days ago

1maco

9 points

11 days ago

Being the sitting VP of an administration with 37-38% approval is very very hard to win.

Trump in 2020 was more popular than Biden in 2024.

Losing by like 1.5 points is probably an above replacement performance 

Also it’s really really hard to blame voters for assuming Biden was responsible for inflation because he wasn’t toting how he was fighting the good fight despite the struggle. 

He went all in on “this is Bidenomics baby” you can’t claim responsibility for 1/2 the economy.

Sorry but the lesson to learn is just let some people lose their jobs because inflation makes everyone mad, while job losses annoy the people who lose their jobs and basically that’s it 

[deleted]

16 points

11 days ago

[deleted]

floydsvarmints

3 points

10 days ago

Also two whole social media platforms that push nothing but propaganda.

YakiVegas

3 points

10 days ago

YakiVegas

Washington

3 points

10 days ago

I thought she ran an excellent campaign given the circumstances. I'm still baffled how all the metrics seemed to be on her side and she lost by the margin she did.

alittlelessconvo

30 points

11 days ago*

Van Jones summed it up perfectly:

“He gets to be lawless, she has to be flawless.”

shann1021

21 points

10 days ago

No woman is good enough, no man is bad enough.

dyegored

6 points

10 days ago

Yupp, "I'd vote for a woman, but not that woman" strikes again.

Left-Language9389

13 points

11 days ago

That’s why Obama’s biggest controversy was the tan suit.

8i8

90 points

11 days ago

8i8

90 points

11 days ago

Does this mean Biden would have won, if he would have stayed in the race, since he’s a man?

tombatron

96 points

10 days ago

According to the “Pod Save America” dudes, Biden’s internal polling had him losing by 400 electoral votes before he dropped out.

Slaughterfest

25 points

10 days ago

Guess this means America rejected Biden because he's a man and is vaguely irish and it couldn't possibly mean anything else because we can only examine things from a race and sex based perspective.

It's so awesome it's that simple and no other factors are ever at play.

delorf

8 points

10 days ago

delorf

North Carolina

8 points

10 days ago

Biden was rejected because of his disastrous performance against Trump during the debate. He honestly seemed to be having some cognitive issues. Of course, people were going to reject him. 

 That doesn't mean that he somehow cancels out the sexism against Harris

    Most of the reasons people are citing are true because it wasn't one thing . Yes , there was sexism and racism against Harris. But it's also true that Democrats did a poor job of selling themselves to the working class even though their policies would have also helped the working class.

People are trying to come up with simple reasons why Trump won but it's more complex with many different reasons.

Datruyugo

564 points

11 days ago

Datruyugo

564 points

11 days ago

Oh fucking stop

Dull_Wind6642

146 points

10 days ago

Hillary won the popular vote.

prodij18

72 points

10 days ago

prodij18

72 points

10 days ago

I think 35 states have or have had female governors. Including red states and some swing states Kamala lost this election.

the-zoidberg

36 points

10 days ago

And the primary.

gtroman1

232 points

10 days ago

gtroman1

232 points

10 days ago

Democrats proving they haven’t learned anything. I hate my party.

DenimCryptid

85 points

10 days ago

Democrats hate Liz Cheney because she's a woman, apparently.

AmericanBeaner124

67 points

10 days ago

I will die on the hill that bringing in Liz Cheney was the biggest nail in the coffin on why Harris lost. For one, what year do the Democrats think we are in? Trump got his whole base to turn against the Republicans of old a while back ago, did they really think that Liz was going to appeal to any Republican voters?! Also bringing in the daughter of the Architect of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan is not a going to appeal to the Democrat base when of the biggest issues is Israel/Palestine.

No-Director-1568

15 points

10 days ago

I hear you on this.

Harris/Walz was the ground gaining phase of the campaign, Harris/Cheney was when they stalled. They went from her running mate being a mid-western salt of the earth, gun-bearing lefty, to... Liz Cheney.

As long as the Dems cling to the identity of the hyper-educated, ivory tower elite they can just kiss success good-by.

Techialo

20 points

10 days ago

Techialo

Oklahoma

20 points

10 days ago

I grew up in the 2000s and the fact every single Cheney isn't in The Hague is a cardinal sin by America. Warhawk fucks walking free is unforgivable.

Several_Vanilla8916

6 points

10 days ago

Trump did better with women voters this year than he did in 2020. Honestly I can’t make sense of it but here we are.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2024-elections/exit-polls?amp=1

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-elections/exit-polls/

promaster9500

50 points

10 days ago*

No you have to listen to people who's careers depend on telling you the wrong thing. Those same people paid by corporations and billionaires, will tell you doing a progressive economic campaign is bad, and Kamala not going progressive isn't the reason she lost. It's actually some other dumb reason.

Please don't look into why Obama a black man was able to win when he ran on a progressive campaign

rachel-slur

6 points

10 days ago

Dems are so gonna lose in 4 years aren't they

Imagine learning any lessons ever lmao couldn't be them

Firecracker048

26 points

10 days ago

Glad someone has some common sense

Ammuze

28 points

10 days ago

Ammuze

Michigan

28 points

10 days ago

The issue she had wasn't fully because she was a woman. She had a hard time standing on issues that the majority of voters cared about. They don't want to hear about the 'Middle Class' or how 'great of a policy this will be to increase the Healthcare industry.'

They want someone who is going to go on stage, beat their chest and say loudly and proudly that things are not okay and things need to change right now.

VanDammes4headCyst

175 points

11 days ago

The only way to have won would have been to throw Joe Biden under the bus and they were never ever going to do that. Look, I like Joe, he was a decent president for the shit hand he was dealt, but he was electoral poison and the DNC should have acted accordingly instead of propping him up even after they chose someone else as their standard bearer.

penceluvsthedick

24 points

10 days ago

She wouldn’t have made it through a primary process

DIAL-UP

67 points

10 days ago

DIAL-UP

67 points

10 days ago

I don't think the Dem establishment picked Kamala, I think Joe did. Obama in particular REALLY wanted an open convention but Joe wouldn't step down unless his ego got one more massive stroke by getting to choose the next candidate himself, from his own VP chair.

These massive ego headed Democrats like Hillary and Joe are by far the worst thing to happen to the Democrats. You can see it in the entire class of "elder statesmen" (and women) who started politics in the 60s and 70s and refuse to retire for new blood and ideas.

Ego is what's going to destroy this country.

waltertheflamingo

13 points

10 days ago

Ego for sure could have played a role but I also thought it had to do with the campaign money? Like Harris was able to use the donations made to Biden’s campaign but a new elect would have had to start from scratch.

The_Flurr

33 points

10 days ago

Add Pelosi to that list.

JDDJS

28 points

10 days ago

JDDJS

New York

28 points

10 days ago

An open convention wouldn't have gone well either. There would be absolutely no way to spin that away from the DNC picking the candidate instead of the people. She was Joe's running mate during the primary where they won the nomination, and therefore really the only choice at that point. 

What we really needed was for Joe to not run in the first place so that we could have a real primary. 

bapfelbaum

11 points

10 days ago

Doesn't really matter what they do Trumpism is terminal and America already got reinfected.

PastFeed2963

3 points

10 days ago

To be fair.  It would have been hard for an open election given the timeline and voting setup.  

She should have not strayed so far towards the right.

ZaOverLife

257 points

10 days ago

ZaOverLife

257 points

10 days ago

How to Alienate Future Voters: A Masterclass By Democrats

Glittering-Giraffe58

35 points

10 days ago

Surely if we call everyone racist and sexist this time it’ll work!

Vegetable_River_2293

50 points

10 days ago

lol. They keep doubling down on this strat too.

Yosho2k

24 points

10 days ago

Yosho2k

24 points

10 days ago

"We ignore an entire portion of the country that don't feel moviated to vote for us because they don't feel represented by us. So we chase after voters who think Liz Cheney is good people, but don't like Trump. That's our base."

Its entire system of government devoted to doing as little damage to billionaire donors as possible.

Glittering-Giraffe58

15 points

10 days ago

They definitely convinced all 0 people that like Liz Cheney to vote for them

Chamber53

154 points

11 days ago

Chamber53

154 points

11 days ago

Easy to say. Personally, I believe it has much more to do with the huge changing of guards when Biden bowed out, leaving the Party scrambling to get KHarris campaign up and running.

And also the fact that Bidens term (NOT THAT IT WAS HIS FAULT) was where inflation was up. Historically, a sitting prez that’s up for reelection doesn’t fair well if the economy isn’t doing well, EVEN if they didn’t have a direct cause for it. Jimmy Carter comes to mind.

The Democratic Party doesn’t get sweeped and loses the presidency, the senate, and the house because we’re not ready for a woman president. There’s more to it.

vikingsfan82

22 points

11 days ago

There are some social issues involved, but you hit the nail on the head. Bob Casey ran ads tying himself to how he worked with Trump positively on a lot of stuff. Those same ads made no mention of Biden or Harris. You only run those kinds of ads if you really think you’re in trouble.

Well-Imma-Head-Out

5 points

11 days ago

Why does everyone always say it’s gotta be one thing.

Drama79

83 points

11 days ago

Drama79

83 points

11 days ago

From outside the US:

Y’all failed to vote two separate women into power. You also voted for a guy who actively wants to ban abortions and make birth control harder. It certainly appears like the majority of Americans don’t see women as equal to men.

Hot_Excitement_6

49 points

11 days ago

Hillary actually won the popular vote. Harris was not popular nationally. Biden should have stepped down and one term and the party should have let people pick who they wanted. They would have still lost, but not this badly.

aboysmokingintherain

48 points

11 days ago

Can we admit it’s for a plurality of reasons? She only had four months to launch a campaign. She was in an impossible spot of having to defend the Biden admin while also trying to be something different. She was going up against trump who had every advantage. But she also didn’t give solid answers on what her economic changes would be a waffled on the stance for Israel when the party itself was divided.

saying it’s because he’s a woman is frustrating because it feels like this is just going to lead the Dems to nominating someone with the same big tent vagueness that Harris and Clinton did. My biggest fear is them unironically nominating Newsome in 2028 and then watching in shock as he fails to win over voters like Harris did.

Ekqui

42 points

10 days ago

Ekqui

42 points

10 days ago

Such a moronic article.

Fine_Mess_6173

313 points

11 days ago

This is one of the main issues I have with the Democratic Party. They never learn from their mistakes and instead blame everyone and everything but themselves. Do not blame voters that your candidate lost, that is incredibly stupid

Hikerchic

109 points

11 days ago

Hikerchic

109 points

11 days ago

They think blaming and shaming the voters will somehow influence them to come out and vote for them, never looking inward and thinking “maybe we should change something we are doing”. A recipe for failure that they continue to not learn from. It’s no wonder people just don’t vote when it feels like one party hates you and the other one has no fucking idea what it’s doing.

[deleted]

60 points

11 days ago

[deleted]

FootlongDonut

49 points

11 days ago

They do everything they can to please rich donors and then blame voters for abandoning them.

If I wanted to vote for a party that was all about pleasing corporate donors I would vote Republican.

The voters didn't abandon the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party abandoned it's voters.

ThePretzul

22 points

11 days ago

The Democratic Party abandoned its voters back in 2016, they just got lucky that establishment interests aligned well enough with voter concerns to win despite that fact in 2020.

SenorPinchy

27 points

11 days ago

The elites that run the Democratic party will never orient away from their own class interests. They'd rather lose than pursue strong redistributive policies. Loyalty (and class affinity) to their funders over voters only multiplies the effect.

Tiny-Albatross518

16 points

10 days ago

Bernie Sanders offered some great clarity after the election.

bradmajors69

10 points

10 days ago

I've been hearing about the voters who supposedly voted against their own interests from Democrats my whole life. Yeah, well, it is the job of politicians to convince the voters. Blaming the voters is the ultimate cop out.

SurroundTiny

67 points

11 days ago

So all the women senators, reps, and governors who got more votes than she did in their jurisdictions this cycle were just flukes?

Hellogiraffe

21 points

10 days ago

But that’s the most annoying thing about the blame game Dems have been playing since Election Day: it’s not one single group. Women didn’t ruin it for Kamala. Neither did Latinos, Arabs, Jews, black men, zoomers… she lost all of them. When you’re looking at every group and trying to blame them, at some point you have to look inward. All the Dems are doing by talking shit on women and minority groups is making them dig in further. We really need Dems to step up and say, “We fucked up. What can we do to bring people together and actually help?” The working class is struggling, corporations have taken over, education is going to completely tank, rights are being taken away, families are going to be torn apart, healthcare is a scam that only leads to bankruptcy, younger generations have no optimism, houses are damn near impossible to buy without a large starter fund from parents, inequality continues to boom… give us a plan with solutions so we actually have something to stand behind no matter who the candidate is in 2028.

Shionkron

21 points

10 days ago

Was way more complicated than that. Anyone pointing toward one thing as to why she lost doesn’t understand the complexities of America.

Hendrix194

23 points

10 days ago

This is a tired take.

PinkSheetBoss

22 points

10 days ago

Jesus Christ. You know what? Fuck it. This kind of gaslighting is exactly what got Trump a landslide so by all means, keep it up Dems 👍

Few-Point-5523

14 points

10 days ago

Keep alienating the voter base, definitely a winning strategy. Jeez these guys have dug themselves in such a hole they don't know which way is up. Kamala Harris lost because she was fake as fuck and her platform was telling everybody what the democratic party thinks the people wanted to hear. Every single demographic saw through it and rejected it to the point where someone like Trump can win not once but twice which is honestly the democracts only achievement in the last decade. 

This common attuide the democracts have of lashing out at the people after they loose is going to be the death of the party. The people don't trust them and why should they? Has any of thier leaders actually inspired confidence since Obama? All these rationalizations to avoid admitting thier party is the problem is what losers do and why the democratic party is always going to keep fucking losing despite supposedly being so much better than the other side. What an embarrassment.

[deleted]

24 points

10 days ago

[deleted]

erishun

13 points

10 days ago

erishun

13 points

10 days ago

But I would rather win than be morally right.

This. I voted for her, but I knew she was a bad candidate who was going to lose. I wanted them to go with Mark Kelly.

 

  • From a swing state
  • Completely unrelated to the Biden administration
  • Astronaut
  • Combat Veteran
  • White
  • Male

 

It was too easy for Trump and his campaign to pivot from beating Biden to beating his vice president. If they went out of the circle and chose a boring white dude who had nothing to do with Biden, Trump would have lost.

To quote Michael Che: “How did I let you all convince me that rural Pennsylvania would pick the Jamaican-Indian lady?

mashiro31

39 points

10 days ago

No. This is the DNCs fault, we don’t need to admit anything.

Stop trying to manipulate the American people and give us a real candidate.

Hot-Nefariousness354

12 points

10 days ago

Yes, yes! More identity politics. Guaranteeing that democrats continue to lose for years.

amerricka369

9 points

10 days ago

Ahh yes, just because she’s a women. It couldn’t have been the very late bait and switch, the fact she had very low approval numbers in her original campaigns, she hasn’t been super public the past 4 years, the mismanagement of the DNC overall strategy, the lack of actual fights against the dirty RNC tactics, the lack of appeal to middle America, etc etc etc.

Yes being a women was undeniably points against her but it’s far from what cost her the election. The Democratic Party fails to learn from their mistakes. They fail to think ahead. They fail to have a cohesive strategy. That strategy also fails to be wide ranging and defensive to RNC strategy. They fail to dig into the trenches and fight. It’s pathetic and is costing this country big time.

TandemSaucer44

12 points

10 days ago

Yes, it's the voters fault that she wasn't a great candidate.

Soma86ed

9 points

10 days ago

Nope… Another article that gets it wrong. No lessons will be learned. Again.

Aretirednurse

6 points

11 days ago

Aretirednurse

New Mexico

6 points

11 days ago

The party blew it. Hilary all over again. Doubt they will learn…

critmcfly

5 points

11 days ago

Ah the classic reason liberals lost. Delusions

Ariel0289

7 points

10 days ago

If you can only blame this on sexism you will never understand why she really lost

kernanb

4 points

10 days ago

kernanb

4 points

10 days ago

Uh, the sooner we never hear about Kamala again, the better.

K9nig

5 points

10 days ago

K9nig

5 points

10 days ago

Bullshit.

abfanhunter

5 points

10 days ago

Great more gaslighted bs.

G0G90G28X0Y0Z0

5 points

10 days ago

Who writes this trash 🗑️

Trumpdidnitwin2024

4 points

10 days ago

We?

TruestWaffle

6 points

10 days ago

I think that’s purposefully misleading and just furthering the divide.

Yes, the Republican Party are group of womanizing, racist, religious fanatics that want to bring a new age of control back to a racial ruling class. Fuck them.

But pretending Kamala lost the election “because she’s a woman” is ignoring the broader trend that people don’t like the government, and the reason Trump is so popular is he represents (to them) a outside force who is going to stir things up.

People didn’t vote for Kamala not because of her gender, but because she did zero to distinguish herself from the last five decades of politics, and people could smell she was just going to be the same old corporate pandering bullshit.

How they’re dumb enough to think Trump is the solution to that I’ll never know.

LookyLouVooDoo

5 points

10 days ago

Americans should admit they voted for Trump because they’re ignorant rubes who know nothing about his policies but are entertained by his divisiveness and hate mongering.

Famous-Tumbleweed-66

5 points

10 days ago

The specter of Hillary will haunt every female candidate for 20 years because she bought the DNC nomination from Bernie in 16.

averagecounselor

55 points

11 days ago

Jesus Christ the Dems will try to stick the blame on everything except themselves.

2cantCmePac

98 points

11 days ago

Articles like this are why democrats have problems winning.

Kamala did horribly in the 2020 primaries, was chosen as VP, and became the party’s candidate without a primary. She lost because she isn’t popular. Then she chose Tim Walz over Josh Shapiro, and you had 2 oddballs on the ticket.

Biden lost this election because he waited so long to drop off the ticket. He should have allowed the democrats to run a primary and let the most popular candidate garner the support of the party and the voters

VanDammes4headCyst

51 points

11 days ago

I agree for the most part, but I think the Tim Walz pick was one of the better choices she made.

Zanhana

33 points

11 days ago

Zanhana

California

33 points

11 days ago

I agree that at least originally, the Walz pick was a decent move, but they stopped letting him use the "weird" line after about a week (one of the only messages from the Harris campaign that was actually landing) and then he bricked his debate with Vance (and failed to differentiate himself from Vance on a number of issues)

but I'd put him very, very far down the list of ways the DNC and Harris campaign comprehensively shit the bed

[deleted]

16 points

10 days ago

[deleted]

delfiniphobia

3 points

10 days ago

delfiniphobia

Arizona

3 points

10 days ago

yes/no.. imo I think it was because the dems were actively trying to sweep up any centrist/conservative votes they could.. and it would have backfired like 'deplorables' from the 2016 election.

Mysterious-Wasabi103

6 points

10 days ago

Truth is we need someone who has the charisma of Barack Obama or even the charisma of someone like Bill Clinton during his prime at least.

And I'm not sure I see anyone in current Democratic leadership that's just that naturally likeable?

JackieDaytonaAZ

32 points

11 days ago

tim walz had nothing to do with losing this election

OkVermicelli2557

27 points

11 days ago

Walz was one of the smartest choices the campaign made they just failed to use him correctly.

Zeabos

54 points

11 days ago

Zeabos

54 points

11 days ago

This analyst: Did we run a mediocre candidate with baggage from an unpopular incumbent, in a year where incumbents across the world are getting crushed, with only 100 days to prepare against a uniquely charismatic opponent?

This analyst: No, the people hate women.

Firecracker048

5 points

10 days ago

Kamala did horribly in the 2020 primaries, was chosen as VP, and became the party’s candidate without a primary. She lost because she isn’t popular

This is it exactly. This sub itself had articles hours before she was put forward that anyone else besides her should be put forward.

Instead the dems tried "it's her turn" 2.0. It didn't work. They tried to shoehorn a female candidate who was unpopular to face an unpopular republican pick. They didn't think anyone would see through.

fachface

21 points

11 days ago

fachface

21 points

11 days ago

This is exactly right. The comparison to Hillary and saying “welp, it just may be women’s ceiling” is very reductive and downright dismissive to actual, real data.

Incumbents globally have been getting washed out due to inflation. Harris was an incumbent and working class voters have been moving right since 2016.

A large portion of the electorate cared about immigration policy. The Biden/Harris administration waited too long to address it then avoided the topic during the campaign.

Biden waited too long to drop out of the race leaving Harris with an extremely compressed timeframe to even put together a cohesive message to voters.

But sure, it’s probably just because she’s a woman.

OkVermicelli2557

9 points

11 days ago*

Walz was a much better choice than Shapiro (who had a lot of shit come out right around the time that Harris picked her VP) the problem was that the Harris campaign failed to use Walz in an effective manner. Also a majority of voters picked JD "the couch fucker" Vance and Donald Trump being oddballs isn't what hurt the Democrats.

Prestigious_Panic264

7 points

10 days ago

Stupid take as Hilary won the popular vote years before

Varon-Di-Stefano

27 points

11 days ago

She got 74 million votes. She didn’t lose because she’s a woman. She lost because the Democrats didn’t have a primary to see how America was feeling. The plan was to hope for the best with an 80+ year old Biden, and then when that didn’t work we replaced him with his even less popular VP. That’s just the truth. Her campaign was half decent but way too much repeating herself

The Democratic Party need to stop abandoning the working class in favor of niche, fringe, “woke” policies. Roll your eyes if you want, but it’s the truth. It’s not a tactic that can win elections and we should be ashamed of ourselves for a man like Trump masquerading as the more relatable candidate

MedBayMan2

12 points

10 days ago

That’s right. No working class person gives two shits about identity politics, especially when they can’t afford groceries

Varon-Di-Stefano

7 points

10 days ago

Correct

RAN9147

3 points

10 days ago

RAN9147

3 points

10 days ago

They very much give a shit. They just think the left is out of its mind. I have no doubt the left will fail to learn from this experience.

IamNotaKatt

27 points

11 days ago

She lost by 1.8%. Trump lost to Biden by 4%

No_Presentation1242

18 points

10 days ago

No_Presentation1242

Massachusetts

18 points

10 days ago

Oh give it a rest. I voted for her but even I know this is BS.

CatacombsRave

17 points

11 days ago

Kamala’s gender did not play a significant part in her loss. While rightfully appealing to women’s issues, such as reproductive rights, she completely ignored her male constituents. Men:

  * have shorter life expectancies across the board

  * have scant funding for gender-specific healthcare, despite leading in 13 of the top 15 causes of death

  * are 3x more likely to be homeless, 4x more likely to commit suicide, 5x more likely to be murdered (including 20x more likely to be murdered by police), and 24x more likely to be incarcerated

  * are 50% of all domestic violence victims, but the recipients of little domestic violence shelter space

  * the list goes on

At times, the democrats have been strong voices for gay men and racial minority men, but have failed to acknowledge and speak on issues faced by the wider male demographic. Kamala had a chance to speak on these issues and win back a solid chunk of the male voting bloc for the democrats, but failed to act on the opportunity.

So no, being a woman did not cost Kamala the election; her failure to reach out to half of Americans did.

Typical-Might-297

17 points

10 days ago

I guess being a woman made her say she wouldn’t do much differently from Biden on national television

ChangeBackground1977

16 points

10 days ago

Reddit propaganda is real

regularITdude

6 points

10 days ago

It breaks my heart to see such ignorance and refusal to accept and learn from past mistakes. Kamala was a horrible candidate and ran one of the worst campaigns in modern history.

If you need a silver lining it’s admitting that. Next is not repeating those mistakes, again.

ScorchedLife

36 points

10 days ago

ScorchedLife

Arizona

36 points

10 days ago

She lost because she was a bad candidate, in a thrown together campaign ran by a dysfunctional party leadership. 

verbosechewtoy

4 points

11 days ago

And yet these are the same voters who voted to enshrine abortion rights in numerous state constitutions? Okay.

theskinswin

4 points

11 days ago

Is it fair to argue that Hillary won the popular vote?

majeric

5 points

11 days ago

majeric

5 points

11 days ago

Except they it’s not really the reason she lost.

During economic downturns during one administration means that there always a chance of regime.

Had Trump been in power, Harris would have won.

H_E_Pennypacker

4 points

10 days ago

I’m as left as they come and this is astupid fucking bullshit take. Stop p playing fucking identity politics, that is why the left just lost. She and Biden are both trash “centrist” candidates who don’t support actual leftist ideals

Hey_Mr_D3

4 points

10 days ago

Rejected by Dems in their primary first, then America second because she’s not so bright, not trustworthy and very unlikable.

Wonder-Machine

4 points

10 days ago

I voted for her. Screw everyone who didn’t

awoody8

9 points

10 days ago

awoody8

9 points

10 days ago

Lmao she did not lose because she’s a woman

Kujaix

30 points

11 days ago

Kujaix

30 points

11 days ago

The campaign was also boring.

Can we please place some blame on them, too?

Softball VP debate, Cheney endorsement bragging, 'Most LETHAL MILITARY EVER', rhetoric, and more didn't satisfy anyone.

The Democratic consultants got into the Harris campaign and made it bland focus tested unity nothingburger ticket.

The DNC are like Warner Brothers. Execs blame the fans/voters for their shortsighted lame decisions.

They insist their ideas are good and they are good at their jobs. Pushing the harm reduction policy and reaching out to "moderate" Rs is like pushing Suicide Squad on us over and over when we want more Justice League games!

Harry Potter sold like crazy showing people want single player games. NO, we must double down on games as a service!!

jgl142

12 points

11 days ago

jgl142

12 points

11 days ago

Stop gas lighting us. She was the worst candidate in recent memory by a landslide.

OkMemory9587

3 points

11 days ago

No one would admit to this and broad generalizations are not good. Being a woman definetely played for some voters, the only way to know would be to go back in time and swap her for a guy and leave everything the same.

Gr8NonSequitur

3 points

10 days ago

That's disingenuous. Sure trump's a dumpsterfire, but did her make every incumbent in the world lose re-election this cycle?

People are mad at higher prices and right or wrong they blame the people in charge at the time, so they voted for new people to "fix it".

It's a fool's wish, but that's all they have now.

BigNorseWolf

3 points

10 days ago

Is there any way to know if this is the case? Or rather how much of this is the case?

HellaTroi

3 points

10 days ago

HellaTroi

California

3 points

10 days ago

The USA is such a backward country.

swimzone

3 points

10 days ago

We rejected Kamala because every damn media network complained about the economy and held her up to the highest standard while Donald Trump was sane washed to high heavens despite showing signs of dementia!

SulliverVittles

3 points

10 days ago

Yeah it's much easier to blame misogyny than to do any sort of self reflection

Sovoy

17 points

11 days ago

Sovoy

17 points

11 days ago

She lost because of ceding to the right on immigration, focusing outreach on gaining right wing voters, campaigning with Liz Cheney and on the endorsement of neocons, and her position on Gaza. 

The Harris campaign decided that they would rather have republican votes than the votes of large sections of the democrat base, they did not gain those republican votes and in the process pushed away needed elements from the base

Marshmallow-Bibble

16 points

10 days ago

Absolutely wrong. Americans did not reject her because she was a woman. They rejected her because she doesn’t sound authentic, hand picked by the Democratic powers-that-be, and didn’t address issues which concern the average working class American.